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	<title>Comments on: Hall on Causation</title>
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	<link>http://tar.weatherson.org/2007/02/22/hall-on-causation/</link>
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		<title>By: ejhall</title>
		<link>http://tar.weatherson.org/2007/02/22/hall-on-causation/comment-page-1/#comment-4973</link>
		<dc:creator>ejhall</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Feb 2007 15:45:26 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Nice! Damn you, of course. Here&#039;s a somewhat simpler counterexample, that doesn&#039;t rely on causation-by-threat-canceling (and I&#039;m embarrassed to say that I already knew of this example, having devised it some time ago for another purpose): A sends signals to C and D. Simultaneously, B sends signals to D and E. The signal from A causes C to fire; likewise, the signal from B causes E to fire. But the simultaneous incoming signals from A and B cause D to short out, so it doesn&#039;t fire. **If it had fired, it would have sent a stimulatory signal to F.** Next, C and E, having fired, each send signals to F, which is a stubborn neuron (needing two stimulatory signals in order to fire). F fires.

The initial firings of A and B jointly cause F to fire. But there is dependence on neither A nor B: If A hadn&#039;t fired, B would have caused both D and E to fire, and each in turn would have sent one of the two needed signals to F. Similarly if B hadn&#039;t fired. 

Here, as in your example, we can save the account if we allow that a &quot;reduction&quot; of the actual situation can remove neurons themselves -- thinking of the presence of these neurons as being a &#039;deviation&#039; from a default state in which nothing is there at all. (That strikes me as unattractive, for various reasons I&#039;ll skip over.) But otherwise there&#039;s trouble: no nomologically possible situation in which strictly fewer firings happen is one in which F depends on A, or on B.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Nice! Damn you, of course. Here&#8217;s a somewhat simpler counterexample, that doesn&#8217;t rely on causation-by-threat-canceling (and I&#8217;m embarrassed to say that I already knew of this example, having devised it some time ago for another purpose): A sends signals to C and D. Simultaneously, B sends signals to D and E. The signal from A causes C to fire; likewise, the signal from B causes E to fire. But the simultaneous incoming signals from A and B cause D to short out, so it doesn&#8217;t fire. <b>If it had fired, it would have sent a stimulatory signal to F.</b> Next, C and E, having fired, each send signals to F, which is a stubborn neuron (needing two stimulatory signals in order to fire). F fires.</p>
<p>The initial firings of A and B jointly cause F to fire. But there is dependence on neither A nor B: If A hadn&#8217;t fired, B would have caused both D and E to fire, and each in turn would have sent one of the two needed signals to F. Similarly if B hadn&#8217;t fired. </p>
<p>Here, as in your example, we can save the account if we allow that a &#8220;reduction&#8221; of the actual situation can remove neurons themselves &#8212; thinking of the presence of these neurons as being a &#8216;deviation&#8217; from a default state in which nothing is there at all. (That strikes me as unattractive, for various reasons I&#8217;ll skip over.) But otherwise there&#8217;s trouble: no nomologically possible situation in which strictly fewer firings happen is one in which F depends on A, or on B.</p>
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		<title>By: Brian Weatherson</title>
		<link>http://tar.weatherson.org/2007/02/22/hall-on-causation/comment-page-1/#comment-4971</link>
		<dc:creator>Brian Weatherson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 26 Feb 2007 19:44:27 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>I used of all things Microsoft Publisher. It was pretty easy to set up, once you are familiar with guidelines and the like.

I&#039;d thought it would be easy to use flowchart type things, but I just found it easier to draw regular circles and arrows.

15 years ago I could have done this thing in my sleep using Corel Draw. But I don&#039;t even know if that still exists, and if it does it has probably got so fancy that it is hard to do simple diagrams with. In any case, I don&#039;t have a copy of any version. (An old version of Corel Draw 3 or 5 might come in handy sometimes, so maybe I should try to dig one up!)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I used of all things Microsoft Publisher. It was pretty easy to set up, once you are familiar with guidelines and the like.</p>
<p>I&#8217;d thought it would be easy to use flowchart type things, but I just found it easier to draw regular circles and arrows.</p>
<p>15 years ago I could have done this thing in my sleep using Corel Draw. But I don&#8217;t even know if that still exists, and if it does it has probably got so fancy that it is hard to do simple diagrams with. In any case, I don&#8217;t have a copy of any version. (An old version of Corel Draw 3 or 5 might come in handy sometimes, so maybe I should try to dig one up!)</p>
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		<title>By: Kenny Easwaran</title>
		<link>http://tar.weatherson.org/2007/02/22/hall-on-causation/comment-page-1/#comment-4970</link>
		<dc:creator>Kenny Easwaran</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 26 Feb 2007 19:38:00 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>What did you use to draw the pretty picture?  Is there some sort of software for these causal nets?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What did you use to draw the pretty picture?  Is there some sort of software for these causal nets?</p>
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