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	<title>Comments on: What is a Gettier Case?</title>
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		<title>By: clayton</title>
		<link>http://tar.weatherson.org/2008/05/15/what-is-a-gettier-case/comment-page-1/#comment-5328</link>
		<dc:creator>clayton</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 17 May 2008 00:09:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://tar.weatherson.org/2008/05/15/what-is-a-gettier-case/#comment-5328</guid>
		<description>I hereby declare that the concept of Gettier case is unanalyzable.  At best, we might state some necessary conditions.  

I happen to think you&#039;re right about Harman&#039;s dead dictator case and I feel the same about the fake barn case.  I believe I&#039;ve started calling these Gettierish cases and if I&#039;m not mistaken (highly unlikely) I think I picked this up from you.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I hereby declare that the concept of Gettier case is unanalyzable.  At best, we might state some necessary conditions.  </p>
<p>I happen to think you&#8217;re right about Harman&#8217;s dead dictator case and I feel the same about the fake barn case.  I believe I&#8217;ve started calling these Gettierish cases and if I&#8217;m not mistaken (highly unlikely) I think I picked this up from you.</p>
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		<title>By: Brian Weatherson</title>
		<link>http://tar.weatherson.org/2008/05/15/what-is-a-gettier-case/comment-page-1/#comment-5320</link>
		<dc:creator>Brian Weatherson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 May 2008 04:05:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://tar.weatherson.org/2008/05/15/what-is-a-gettier-case/#comment-5320</guid>
		<description>Yeah, I&#039;m being sloppy with that. What I want is something like Ernie Sosa&#039;s idea that some beliefs are not true in virtue of being produced by a virtuous process. But perhaps that isn&#039;t right either.

The reason I don&#039;t like the third definition is that I think there are some cases, like Harman&#039;s dead dictator case, that feel like an importantly different kind of case to the &#039;coincidental truth&#039; cases that I think are the core kind of Gettier case.

Perhaps you&#039;re right about what&#039;s crucial is that the beliefs are reasonable, whether or not they&#039;re justified. I&#039;ll have to think about that more.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yeah, I&#8217;m being sloppy with that. What I want is something like Ernie Sosa&#8217;s idea that some beliefs are not true in virtue of being produced by a virtuous process. But perhaps that isn&#8217;t right either.</p>
<p>The reason I don&#8217;t like the third definition is that I think there are some cases, like Harman&#8217;s dead dictator case, that feel like an importantly different kind of case to the &#8216;coincidental truth&#8217; cases that I think are the core kind of Gettier case.</p>
<p>Perhaps you&#8217;re right about what&#8217;s crucial is that the beliefs are reasonable, whether or not they&#8217;re justified. I&#8217;ll have to think about that more.</p>
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		<title>By: clayton</title>
		<link>http://tar.weatherson.org/2008/05/15/what-is-a-gettier-case/comment-page-1/#comment-5316</link>
		<dc:creator>clayton</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 May 2008 20:17:05 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>There&#039;s something problematic about the second account.  It seems that a Gettier case cannot be a case of knowledge, but it&#039;s not obvious (to me) that it is impossible for there to be a case in which S forms a true, and justified, belief, but where the reasons it is true, and the reasons it is justified, are entirely different where S also knows p.  The cases are controversial, but I&#039;m thinking of cases of knowledge derived from falsehood.  Similar worries arise for the first.

I&#039;d be happiest with the third, but there&#039;s just one more wrinkle.  There are some views on which a justified belief *just is* knowledge.  I have in mind Sutton&#039;s view and although some people don&#039;t like to own up to this, it seems some people&#039;s views concerning warranted assertion commit them to this view.  As tempting as it might be to say such views are committed to the impossibility of Gettier cases, advocates of such views can say pretty much what the rest of us want to say about such cases.  They can say a subject is justified in believing p, p is true, but the belief that p is not justified as it fails to constitute knowledge (drawing on Bach and Engel&#039;s distinction between personal and doxastic justification).  They can say as Sutton does that the belief in Gettier cases is _reasonable_ but not justified.  So, I&#039;m not quite sure that the definition of a Gettier case should be one in which there is justified _belief_ that fails to constitute knowledge.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There&#8217;s something problematic about the second account.  It seems that a Gettier case cannot be a case of knowledge, but it&#8217;s not obvious (to me) that it is impossible for there to be a case in which S forms a true, and justified, belief, but where the reasons it is true, and the reasons it is justified, are entirely different where S also knows p.  The cases are controversial, but I&#8217;m thinking of cases of knowledge derived from falsehood.  Similar worries arise for the first.</p>
<p>I&#8217;d be happiest with the third, but there&#8217;s just one more wrinkle.  There are some views on which a justified belief <strong>just is</strong> knowledge.  I have in mind Sutton&#8217;s view and although some people don&#8217;t like to own up to this, it seems some people&#8217;s views concerning warranted assertion commit them to this view.  As tempting as it might be to say such views are committed to the impossibility of Gettier cases, advocates of such views can say pretty much what the rest of us want to say about such cases.  They can say a subject is justified in believing p, p is true, but the belief that p is not justified as it fails to constitute knowledge (drawing on Bach and Engel&#8217;s distinction between personal and doxastic justification).  They can say as Sutton does that the belief in Gettier cases is <em>reasonable</em> but not justified.  So, I&#8217;m not quite sure that the definition of a Gettier case should be one in which there is justified <em>belief</em> that fails to constitute knowledge.</p>
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